User talk:Roy 043: Difference between revisions

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== Cleanup 20230606 ==
== File:Std_SetAppearance_taskpanel.png ==


I have cleaned up this page. For the previous version see:
Why did you change this image to a larger version? What is in your opinion better with the new image you uploaded?
https://wiki.freecad.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Roy_043&oldid=1285531
I have the problem that on my 15 inch laptop I often use it is hard to read the Wiki pages, especially because images are too large. Therefore I consequently only depict what the user has to see to understand the functionality. Thus please compare


--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 14:27, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
https://wiki.freecadweb.org/images/archive/a/a1/20210918143420%21Std_SetAppearance_taskpanel.png


== TechDraw Drawing Examples and Draft Snap Dimensions ==
with


Hi Roy,
https://wiki.freecadweb.org/images/a/a1/Std_SetAppearance_taskpanel.png


the TechDraw Drawing Examples page was named to match with TechDraw Section Examples which also lists what TechDraw can do (and what not, yet). Was it necessary to move/rename it to TechDraw Examples?
The first image is smaller and only contains the dialog itself. The Close button and the tabbar are waste of space since all dialogs have these, so dialog-specific info is provided for the costs of a larger size. Therefore I think the image I uploaded improved the situation.


The Draft Snap Dimensions tool has to be finished with a click to confirm the point like all real snap tools, too. Why shouldn't this last step not be mentioned?
thanks and regards Uwe
--[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 19:28, 19 September 2021 (UTC)


--[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 08:21, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
:Dear Uwe,


: "TechDraw Drawing Examples" is a strange title. "Drawing" is redundant and also too reminiscent of the obsolete Drawing WB. Maybe then use "TechDraw General Examples"?
:I disagree that the button can be removed from the screen shot. It is essential part of the task panel. Other task panels have different buttons for example. I have uploaded this screenshot twice. The 2nd version of the image has clearly visible frames. That is another important element that is missing from your version.


: BTW: Why do you say: "some examples about what TechDraw is already capable to do". It implies that TD is still underdeveloped when that is hardly the case.
:But I have to admit that this 2nd discussion about this image and this page really, really annoys me. To put an end to it I have now decided to remove the image from the page. That way we both don't get what we want.


: Regarding Draft Snap Dimensions: The tool itself does not suggest a point to the user, therefore there is nothing to confirm. So the text would have to be different.
:--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 09:34, 23 September 2021 (UTC)


: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 14:24, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
::>It is essential part of the task panel. Other task panels have different buttons for example.
::But why do you think so? I have to work at work on a laptop screen and it is sometimes hard to read the Wiki pages because of the large images. Often there cnnot be done anything, but an OK/Cancel/Abort/Stop etc button is not providing info about the feature. Therefore it can be omitted an I try to omit them because it improves the readability on laptop screens.
::> But I have to admit that this 2nd discussion about this image and this page really, really annoys me.
::What discussion are you referring to? I cannot see a discussion page for the image
::> To put an end to it I have now decided to remove the image from the page. That way we both don't get what we want.
::Boah, this is childish! Who are we? Playgroud kids or adult developers who should be able to discuss, have disagreements and find a consensus?


:: In the end I can live with both alternatives with a light tendency towards General Examples.
:: I told you why I see a topic differently and you don't want to take this and replay but be immediately annoyed. I don't understand this. I mean i would understand when i would have reverted something. But no I just contacted you here, that's all.


:: TD is underdeveloped if we have to define section views in 3d space, have no real auxiliary views, cannot rotate a view without messing with the dimensions, have no view grid starting at a meaningful point and following the view's axes, cannot rotate balloons. Maybe I will find some more. Yes TD has made a leap forward with the extensions, but they also have some potential for improvement.
::--[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 13:11, 27 September 2021 (UTC)


:: If we do not care about standards, FreeCAD is great, but it wants to be an application for professionals, too and there still lies some way to go towards this goal. This examples page is intended be used as a base of discussion, and to clarify terms that I or other not natives maybe use wrong. It is quite hard to find create simple examples to describe missing features in contrast to existing ones.
::: I was referring to a previous discussion in the forum. It is that discussion where you accused others of playing 'pingpong' (while you were still holding the bat behind your back so to speak). Do you remember? If you want to use the adjective 'childish' you may want to consider your own attitude then and now. I know that your are very stubborn, and do not easily accept the ideas of others. I can point to another discussion in the forum that can attest to that. You even once went so far as to undo an edit that fixed a grammatical error in one of your contributions. You equate your own ideas with progress, reaching a consensus with somebody who thinks like that is impossible.


:: Regarding snapping: I read it as confirm the (new) end point of the current line segment rather than to confirm the (existing) selected point.
::: Note that removing the image has the additional advantage that you are no longer tempted to 'beautify' the layout...


::: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 14:46, 27 September 2021 (UTC)
::--[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 15:19, 6 July 2023 (UTC)


Thanks for clarifying. I have renamed the example page to [[TechDraw_General_Examples|TechDraw General Examples]]. I have removed the 2 redirects that were automatically created.
== Names of props in the GUI start with a cap ==


I'll look at Draft Snap Dimensions again later.
Hi Roy, thanks for having a look at my edits and for some useful hints, but this coment in the headline puzzles me.


--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 08:45, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
The properties' names in the property editor do not start with capitals and as far as I know (or rather believe...) that resembles the orthography of the python code and should therefore be carried over into the wiki descriptions.


: I was quite scared the the page disappeared (again) a few minutes ago... lol
Is it a convention that I haven't stumbled across yet?


[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 19:19, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
: --[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 08:52, 7 July 2023 (UTC)


== Sketcher Offset ==
: I see now that this is not handled consistently in the SheetMetal Workbench. F.e for a bend you have:
:* Bend Type
:* angle
:* base Object
: The name of the last property looks weird of course and gives you an idea of the algorithm used to populate the [[Property_editor|Property editor]].
: I'll revert my mod.


Hi Roy, I wonder if the shortcut of Sketcher Offset has changed as the tool tip says '''Offset geometries (Z, O)''' (and also not geometry).
: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 20:01, 20 August 2021 (UTC)


--[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 09:58, 6 December 2023 (UTC)
:: It definitely looks weird...


: I have made a PR to change the menu text and the shortcut ("Z, O" was already in use):
:: [[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 21:02, 20 August 2021 (UTC)
: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/pull/11656
: I should have mentioned this in my Wiki edits, sorry for the confusion.


: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 20:49, 6 December 2023 (UTC)
== We are documenting V0.20 ==
Question regarding: https://wiki.freecadweb.org/index.php?title=Std_Base&diff=next&oldid=877729
You write there "we are documenting V0.20", but the vast majority of users use FC 0.19.x.
Now the Wiki hides an important feature for > 90% of the users. That doesn't see correct. --[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 16:52, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


::I see... It is a good idea to mention a forthcoming PR if changes are not yet visible as David69 also spotted the change from geometries to geometry in the GuiCommand section.
== Please follow the standards! ==


::--[[User:FBXL5|FBXL5]] ([[User talk:FBXL5|talk]]) 08:29, 7 December 2023 (UTC)
Why did you do this?:
https://wiki.freecadweb.org/index.php?title=PartDesign_AdditiveHelix&diff=next&oldid=872236

You talk about a standard. Where can I find this standard and who developed it? I cannot find a standard that defines that we use as text the same internal name of the referred Wiki page.

My opinion is: The Wiki is to inform people and not to bother them with internal names. Let's therefore please keep it simple.

--[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 02:39, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

: Uwe, there has been a [https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=54805 discussion] about these standards and the [[GuiCommand_model|GuiCommand model]] page on the forum. And if you take a look at the PartDesign pages you will notice that in most cases the SeeAlso links follow the standard (which is actually the standard for links in general BTW). The standard is very much based on how previous editors have done things. It is not the opinion of a single person.
: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 08:13, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

:: Thanks for the pointer to [[GuiCommand_model|GuiCommand model]]. However, I cannot see in this page that we must use for the link text use the internal name. I mean, look at the DocNav of [[PartDesign_AdditivePipe]]. For good reasons we us a simple text for the link and not the whole internal name. So why can't we do the same for the "See also field"? In fact the DocNav acts as a "see Also" too.
::> The standard is very much based on how previous editors have done things. It is not the opinion of a single person.
:: That is clear, but what I don't see is that things can be changed. When it was not done right, or let's say "convenient for average reader/users", we can and even should change this.
:: --[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 20:37, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

== Math and Nowiki ==

I see that you change <math> tags to <nowiki>, for example here: https://wiki.freecadweb.org/index.php?title=Sketcher_BSplineDecreaseKnotMultiplicity&diff=856101&oldid=854468
But this is not the intended usage. nowiki is typographically spoken verbatim. But math follow the myth typography guidelines (half spaces around operators, italic variables etc.). So math should be used for equations. nowiki only for text to be unformatted.

(For information, you can directly copy TeX code into <math> and this can be created even with Word or Libreoffice nowadays.)

thanks and regards --[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 13:10, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

I started the talk here, but you moved it to my talk page, why? --[[User:Uwestoehr|uwestoehr]] ([[User talk:Uwestoehr|talk]]) 18:06, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

== Torus etc. ==

Good day, looking at your edit: https://wiki.freecadweb.org/index.php?title=Part_Torus&oldid=853357

Has this been changed very recently? With Version: 0.19.23756 I can create a Torus following the way that you removed. -- [[User:Hmk|Hmk]] ([[User talk:Hmk|talk]]) 14:36, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

: You can create a torus with the [[Part_Primitives|Part Primitives]] command. That is correct. But you cannot start the [[Part_Torus|Part Torus]] command via the Part Primitives command. So instructing the user that one of the ways to invoke the Part Torus command is to first start the Part Primitives command, does not make sense.
:--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 21:21, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

== Misc ==

Dear Roy,

I do not appreciate that you removed my edit. If we want to succeed as a community we need a healthy ecosystem, from developers to educators. of course, YouTubers can ask for support from their viewers, and they do, but they can also encourage them to support developers. It should be a bidirectional relationship. if YouTubers feel welcomed, if they are treated like family then both will benefit. What you did cause a great deal of pain for a great member of our family and I hope you put the edit back. Thanks for your understanding.

Best,
Foador

: I have answered here: [[User_talk:Foadsf]]

Hi Roy,

Thanks a lot for the fixes to my edits and for bringing to my attention that I had edited an obsolete page :)

For https://wiki.freecadweb.org/index.php?title=Std_Edit&diff=next&oldid=840510, links to files on GitHub using the master branch aren't reliable (files move and code moves with time). Would you be okay with this form instead? [https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/blob/master/src/Gui/ViewProvider.h#L423-L427 src/Gui/ViewProvider.h] ([https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/blob/135525a8066703059603be1a395986327e635568/src/Gui/ViewProvider.h#L423-L427 archived version])

Cheers,
[[User:Suzanne.soy|Suzanne Soy]] ([[User talk:Suzanne.soy|talk]]) 22:17, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

: Let's avoid the problem and do away with the link altogether.

: --[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 16:40, 22 January 2021 (UTC)


Dear Roy, <br>
This is Melwyncarlo from [[User talk:Melwyncarlo|UserTalk]]. Anyway, I see you have deleted my edit this morning. That command really is faulty. While your reasoning was appropriate, I've added a small addendum notifying other users that the older command works on version 0.18. Note that it also works in 0.19. But, the new command, unfortunately, is not backward compatible. Most users use 0.18, so solely displaying the new command is misleading and confusing. I'd be glad if a note is added. <br>
Thank you very much. Regards, <br>MFC Boy : the one and only! 12:31, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

:: Ideally we would have several versions of the wiki. But that is not realistic since we simply lack volunteers willing to invest a serious amount of time. That is why we can and SHOULD only document the coming version. I will leave you addition even though it goes against this. I suppose you will remove it when V0.19 becomes final?
::--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 15:39, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

::: Hello Roy, <br>
:::I understand what you are saying; it is silly to have documentations for several versions. I agree, it is. But I'm just talking about adding small command script addendums on the go (like my example). I'm only saying this because some new commands DON'T work on older versions. And even after the v0.19 release, many will still be using v0.18 for quite some time. And so, macro commands run on the older versions would fail. I, myself, was frustrated when the new commands didn't work in my macros (which is being run on v0.18). Furthermore, hinting about the old commands would allow programmers to write code which is backward compatible.
::: - [[User talk:Melwyncarlo|Melwyncarlo]] 05:00, 1 March 2021 (UTC)


Please improve your Scripting paragraphs
<br>Hi Melwyncarlo, I see that you are adding similar scripting paragraphs with the same code on many pages ...
<br>... Another issue is that you are using several tricks to get a custom layout ...
<br>--[[User:Roy 043|Roy 043]] ([[User talk:Roy 043|talk]]) 01:47, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
:: Hello Roy, regarding the custom layout (apart from my Macro AeroFoil page), I'm using the basic layout; could you please be more specific as to where I've deviated from the styling norm? Thank you.
::Also, the run commands are as it is. It's not about being fancy; those are the simplest copy-paste commands. I've stated that you select the objects, and then run those commands. That's all there is to it. It's like doing a Control+C and Control+V using Python.
::I guess I could add the 'addSelection' method to all those run commands to show how to select the objects using Python. But, I had added the 'Selection Methods' link instead, which exemplifies the very same concept. What do you think? Should I add a sort-of mini-tutorial?
:: - [[User talk:Melwyncarlo|Melwyncarlo]] 03:30, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
:::Layout - Thank you for notifying me, Roy. I'll stop using the {{Incode|&lt;br&gt;}} on public documentation.
:::Scripting - I won't be doing it for any other pages. All those commands were about copy-pasting in different ways. Hence the similarity in code.
::: - [[User talk:Melwyncarlo|Melwyncarlo]] 15:30, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

== Artwork Assembly ==

Hi Roy 043,

I don't get your point.
There's no Assembly workbench bundled with recent FreeCAD versions (0.19.1, 0.20-24825) but Assembly3 is.
Why shouldn't we extend a list of icons, that is hardly use for other wiki sites, with icons that are in use now for a similar task.
That totally makes sense to me.

The FreeCAD version that I have used do not contain an Assembly folder which shows me that this is obsolete.
Since Assembly3 is bundled now the Assembly folder should be re-added for the Assembly3 stuff or the asm3 instead.

How long do you want to keep obsolete stuff unchanged?

Latest revision as of 08:30, 7 December 2023

Cleanup 20230606

I have cleaned up this page. For the previous version see: https://wiki.freecad.org/index.php?title=User_talk:Roy_043&oldid=1285531

--Roy 043 (talk) 14:27, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

TechDraw Drawing Examples and Draft Snap Dimensions

Hi Roy,

the TechDraw Drawing Examples page was named to match with TechDraw Section Examples which also lists what TechDraw can do (and what not, yet). Was it necessary to move/rename it to TechDraw Examples?

The Draft Snap Dimensions tool has to be finished with a click to confirm the point like all real snap tools, too. Why shouldn't this last step not be mentioned?

--FBXL5 (talk) 08:21, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

"TechDraw Drawing Examples" is a strange title. "Drawing" is redundant and also too reminiscent of the obsolete Drawing WB. Maybe then use "TechDraw General Examples"?
BTW: Why do you say: "some examples about what TechDraw is already capable to do". It implies that TD is still underdeveloped when that is hardly the case.
Regarding Draft Snap Dimensions: The tool itself does not suggest a point to the user, therefore there is nothing to confirm. So the text would have to be different.
--Roy 043 (talk) 14:24, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
In the end I can live with both alternatives with a light tendency towards General Examples.
TD is underdeveloped if we have to define section views in 3d space, have no real auxiliary views, cannot rotate a view without messing with the dimensions, have no view grid starting at a meaningful point and following the view's axes, cannot rotate balloons. Maybe I will find some more. Yes TD has made a leap forward with the extensions, but they also have some potential for improvement.
If we do not care about standards, FreeCAD is great, but it wants to be an application for professionals, too and there still lies some way to go towards this goal. This examples page is intended be used as a base of discussion, and to clarify terms that I or other not natives maybe use wrong. It is quite hard to find create simple examples to describe missing features in contrast to existing ones.
Regarding snapping: I read it as confirm the (new) end point of the current line segment rather than to confirm the (existing) selected point.
--FBXL5 (talk) 15:19, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for clarifying. I have renamed the example page to TechDraw General Examples. I have removed the 2 redirects that were automatically created.

I'll look at Draft Snap Dimensions again later.

--Roy 043 (talk) 08:45, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

I was quite scared the the page disappeared (again) a few minutes ago... lol
--FBXL5 (talk) 08:52, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

Sketcher Offset

Hi Roy, I wonder if the shortcut of Sketcher Offset has changed as the tool tip says Offset geometries (Z, O) (and also not geometry).

--FBXL5 (talk) 09:58, 6 December 2023 (UTC)

I have made a PR to change the menu text and the shortcut ("Z, O" was already in use):
https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/pull/11656
I should have mentioned this in my Wiki edits, sorry for the confusion.
--Roy 043 (talk) 20:49, 6 December 2023 (UTC)
I see... It is a good idea to mention a forthcoming PR if changes are not yet visible as David69 also spotted the change from geometries to geometry in the GuiCommand section.
--FBXL5 (talk) 08:29, 7 December 2023 (UTC)